a get is a mitzvah in the Torah, no different than shabbos and shofar
BUT, if a couple dates and decides that this is it, then it is or should be a shande to get divorced over ego or miscommunication or i-can-do-better
You will never get perfect, only G-d is perfect, humans all have flaws, research and dating is when the flaws need to be discovered and dealt with, not after the plunge
Agreed.
However a get is an optional mitzva (similar to shâchita - today one is not obligated to eat meat, but if s/he does, then there is a mitzva of shâchita). Shabbas and shofar are not.
Definition of the Problem/Crisis:
The number of Orthodox non-chassidishe young women who have been dating five years or longer
and are still single is greater â by the thousands â than the number of Orthodox non-chassidise young men who have been dating five years or longer. That single statement defines the shidduch crisis.
This statement doesnât address what caused this situation it simply defines what many people mean when they use the term Shidduch Crisis in the non chassidishe world.
one only need hear shofar on rosh hashana
one only need to keep shabbos on the 7th day of the week
so too one only needs to eat meat when it is mitzvah like korban pesach and many would say at a seudas mitzvah e.g. bris seyum wedding yomtov seudah
if a couple find their spouse repulsive then it too would require the mitzvah of giving a get
in shas its written, if a man finds someone better than his wife (tova memenah) which Chazal say is not her fault, but rather his bad midah, he must see his wife as the best for him, if he has worked on his middos to be mevater, to speak like a mench, to cherish his wife. than he would never see anyone as tovah memenah
if he has not, then you better believe its a mitzvah to let her go
Definition of the Problem: The number of Orthodox non-chasÂsidishe young women who have been dating five years or longer and are still single is greater â by the thousands â than the number of Orthodox non-chassidise young men who have been dating five years or longer.
That single statement defines the shidduch crisis.
What are your thoughts? How can we help?
Youâd have to reform the school system. Ready to take that on? LOL
Itâs real. I am on every shidduch site I can find as well as Jewish dating sites but wonât receive help because I am a modern Jewish gal and although willing to increase my level of Jewishkeitness many shidduchs will not give me the opportunity because I am over 40, divorced with 3 kids (well one is over 18). I also have to share them with their father in the state of Indiana for 6 more years and that is tough for such a man to be found but yet I donât think any Shidduch has ever really tried on my behalf.
No we do not have a Shidduch Crises, WE HAVE A CHOOSY CRISES !
I have personally met hundreds of older singles that are really not choosy and yet they are not married yet.
Let me explain what I mean. These are my thoughts and my opinion and many are going to be outraged but this is how I see it: All this talk of marrying off boys at a younger age does not really hold water. Itâs been centuries of older men marrying younger women.
There was a shidduch crisis for Yeshiva bochurim in Poland that spurred the Bais Yaakov movement. Sara Shenirer realized that the girls did not share the Torah values of the boys so she set out to teach them the beauty of Torah so that they would have common goals.
Nowadays we have an educational crisis as well( I am speaking in very broad terms(I realize) about the âYeshivishâ non-chassidish school system).Our Bais yaakov Graduates come out 95%, the way the system intended them to: educated in Halacha and Hashakafah, âtzanuotâ, frum, ready for seminary, ready to take on the world: either by continuing their secular education or getting a job. Many girls have internalized the messages of their schools and are ready to marry a guy who davens 3 times a day, is kovea itim/works or is going to Kollel. They also spent years studying, doing homework, taking tests, making sure to come to school on time, do chessed hours, worked on their middos as part of the curriculumâŚHowever,(and this is my number for argument sake: it could be inflated or deflated) The boys system is totally different. It is an educational system made totally so that many girls and boys cannot marry each other: The top 20% successful (according to mesivtas) that is going to end up in major yeshivas usually do not have a hard time finding from a much larger pool of girls who are ready to work and sacrifice for a life of Torah and Kollel. Boys who are good boys but not really self-motivated to learn like lean learning machines have a hard time starting their day with minyan and end with night seder 12-14 hours later. they are also being told that they are the next gadol hador, the next talmid chochom since preschool and that works till about 6th grade. Then reality sets in and many realize that they are not cut out for full time learning forever. But by then, theyâve been told that anything less than this lifestyle is worth nothing. They feel like nothings. They feel Ok or mediocre at best, going trhough the motions. No one tells them that their frumkeit and their ability to learn are totally not related and that you can still be frum and ehrlich and have a secular education or a job. We also donât teach our boys the importance of the journey, they just want to get there. No homework, no hard work. Either a groisse talmid chochom or a wealthy businessman will do. Everything else is not worth mentioning. And since their self-esteem, self-worth and frumkeit is all tied to their ability to learn, many boys feel like losers and start acting like bums. We lose a lot of boys every year⌠Many become less frum, less committed, less growth oriented, less spiritual, in some cases some become mechalellei shabbos, many drink, smoke, do pot, not exactly what the bais yaakov graduates want to marry⌠It feels as if the system for girls help them grow to function at their best potential but not the boys⌠They are also not given any breaks. The girls can do all kinds of accelerated programs to support a kollel lifestyle. But very few boysâ schools help and encourage boys to pursue an education or a job when Kollel is not âtheir thingâ. There is a huge dichotomy between the graduates of our âsystemâ. And as they get older, many more women retain their idealism and frumkeit. The reality is that I donât think that women over 30 are choosy, they have very little to choose from.
Omain!!! Thank you for a beautiful beracha, ALIZASOSNE. I agree that we all we need in shidduchim and in life generally is clarity. May all of us be zoiche to find the Right One, not the Perfect One, but the Right One, that is Right for each person.
Ah Git Gebenched Yuhr to all Klal Yisrael!
I completely agree with you that the main points are a similarity in hashkafas and values, middas tovas and mutual goals.
Thatâs why the people in mature age need time to meet and to talk to see if they are really competable. Nobody is perfect, it is only a matter to feel comfortable with each other. Nevertheless, there are some particular categories that everyone should be careful with. According to the Rebbetzin Sara Yoheved Rigler, who is a well-known shidduch coach, they are: abusive & controlling, addicted, having some mental issues/disabilities. According to the rebbetzin Rigler the last category could be managed. Rebbetzin Rigler developed a great teaching, very well structured, which helps the single girl/women to improve themselves and to set up their goals in purpose to get married in a real term. She provides a 10-weeks course teaching about:
Here is the link to her The Ladder site.
Also, there are many brilliant books that teach how to deal with shaddchanim, to be in shidduchim, explaining in great details every step of this difficult and painful process.
Based on my own experience speaking to the men, who are looking for the right one to remarry, Iâve never heard of any successful story when two frum people met one-two times, they saw from the beginning that they donât match at all, but decided to try following a principle âWhy not to try it?â. As much I heard from them, it was a mistake and a marriage didnât last long, in most of the cases less than a year.
Another point that iIagree about, that some frum people are looking for one to fall in love to. I do believe that an attraction is a pre-requisite for a happy marriage and two people should really enjoy each other, but we all learn from the Torah, that Yitzchok first brought Rivka to the tent of his mother, then he married her and only after that he loved her. According to my Ruv, two people should share their lives for a long time to deserve such a great feeling as a true love is.
To make it clear, all the specific characteristics that Iâve described in my message, were mentioned with the constructive purpose regarding the solving the shidduch crisis, not to insult anyone Chas vâShulom.
Thank you for understanding.
CGSINGER, I agree that we should accept one that we have chosen to be a husband or wife whoever the person is once a decision has been made and the religious marriage has been performed. But please donât neglect the specific time that we live in right now. Before the upcoming of Mashiach the whole world becomes spiritually darker and darker. It affects all aspects of our life. As you can see, our life becomes more and more intense and complicated every day and less and less people are able to handle this overwhelming and a heighly competitive environment. Our frum world is not an exception. All the simple models of a finding a good shidduch and building a happy life work mostly for the people, who live a simple life. But today it is not so common. Iâve met B"H hundreds of frum families in last a few years and I can say confidentally that the more simple lifestyle the family keeps, the happier all the family members are. Iâve never seen any problems with shidduchim in such families.
So, the key and the solution for many current problems in our frum society is to make our life more simple. Then Yetzer Hara will have less material to work on. Hashem always protects simple and sincere people.
Should be a yasher koach button for this post!
Thank you for your support of the reality. To find an ehrlich man who has good middas, Yiras Shamaim, is a mentch and is not easy at all, especially taking into consideration a matching hashkafa as well as a level of education regardless secular or religious. I asked many friends of mine, the ultra-chassidim, who are happily married with many children and they sincerely care for me, if Iâm asking for too much. They all confirmed that my criteria are right and all I mentioned is the basic requirement. There could be a difference in an educational level and slightly in hashkafa, but the first three positions that I mentioned above, which actually form a definition of a Mentch, should be presented clearly.
Not sure if this has been mentioned already but I do think there is a crisis. I know several guys/girls who have everything anyone could want in a spouse and yet they cannot get married.
My thoughts on why is primarily because todayâs singles have unrealistic expectations and requirements from what they are looking for. Silly things like, she doesnât wear high heels, he doesnât have a beard or has a beard. Not to mention the ego involved. Some women seem to think that itâs the guys sole purpose to be the provider while she sits home and plays housewife (while this can be true and has been true in ages past - today itâs rare due to cost of living).
If a guy is going to look at a girl (in a movie/magazine/internet/etc) he will build up expectations of what his wife should look like - same for girls. Then when they canât seen to find anyone attractive they blame their lack of options. Not to mention all the other psychological issues people have today that previously were not as prominent.
Hollywood is a perfect example of why there is such a high divorce rate, people get married for all the wrong reasons but at the same time advertise those reasons as the right ones to get married for.
There are plenty of Rabbeim who have discussed this topic to far greater length than anyone here - and they are far more exposed to singles who are dying to get married. Just look on torahanytime for one example and see just how bad it isâŚ
Iâm sorry, I donât see any connection between my message and your reply. If you can find for me a man that has the main three criteria that I mentioned, he is a mentch, echrlich with good middas and is in my circle matching my hashkafa (we donât use smartphones, donât go to the goyshe and secular places, are careful to not to have any non-Yiddishe elements in our life, very careful with Tznius and guarding our eyes and tongs), I will greatly appreciate your effort. Maybe in your zechus i could find my bashert?
I would suggest to use a more polite word âselectiveâ when we speak about people in shidduchim. It is very hard Parsha, everybody knows that, and the more sensitivity and empathy we show to each other, the more we will get back from Hashem in the same way.
Iâve read and studied many books and all great materials from the prominent Rabbonim, shaddchanim and all people around in purpose to learn how to practically get married. All of them speak Emes and give absolutely correct and applicable tools. But in every particular shidduch case is always some specific point or reason that I personally canât accept for my future marriage, such as rude, abusive and controlling behavior, mental issues or other things that are very good for someone else (TV, FaceBook, etc.), but not for me. I donât think that in such a case a person should be considered choosy.
On another hand, the process can be endless, but the bottom line is that we have to get married. Perhaps a parable could help us to make a decision when a shidduch is at least matching the main criteria and then to accept all other sides that were not revealed to us before the final decision was made. Imagine that you have a very big upcoming Simcha, you are the main part of it and you need a stunning outfit for this special occasion. This is the One Time in a Life Event and you have to be there on-time. You canât miss it. So, you go shopping, looking and looking and looking around for the best outfit to impress everyone. Nothing is on the market that you like very much and nothing that fits you perfectly. And you are facing the reality that the Simcha Day is approaching very soon. What should you do? You sould ask yourself: âWhat is the main part of this event, a Simcha itself of how Iâm going to look like there?â. When not so much time is left over, I believe, the excitement of Simcha, a happy life with a spouse and children. and having a completed, full keily of a Yiddishe mishpucha, should help to make an execuive decision based on your undestanding, that it is all from Hashem. Then, the best outfit you see in the store, should be the one that Hashem designated for you, and even it doesnât fit perfectly, your smile and sincere happiness of being not alone anymore will overwrite many uncomfortable feelings you hade before this Event. And then, as anyother things donât fit us and they are not attached to us in the beginning, but it becomes a part of us soon after we start to wear it every day with our full enjoyment.
Iâm just trying to craft my own tool to help myself to arrive at the Simcha on-time. Maybe it will help other singles as well.
Rabbi Sheifer of TheShmuz.com says one reason for the difficulty is that many people really arenât looking for their âbeshertâ. They have compiled a list of must have (or must not have). He refers to this as the person actually looking for Mr. or Mrs. Potato Head (where you choose the eyes, nose, mouth,etc). HaShem actually knows the kind of person that we need as opposed to us looking for the person that we want.
I personally think that we live in an age in which most of want to be sure that it will work before we can actually know. Marriage is a life long job - it must be worked at daily in order to make it work.
how can you compare a beard with spike shoes?
beard is a haskafa thing, shoes a material
A guy choosing to shave is NOT the same as a girl choosing heels.